Page 1 of 17 
 
Washington Women’s Heritage Project records, 1900-2000 
University of Washington Libraries Special Collections 
Vi Hilbert 
1981  
Cassette 1, Side 2 
 
 
Vi Hilbert  00:00 
I think there's the most important subject to be taught. 
 
Interviewer 2  00:05 
Well it's all going to be done behind closed doors and smoky dark rooms by deans and provosts. 
And I think it's already been done and no one's had much-- and you can sort of predict what'll go 
first.  
 
Vi Hilbert  00:19 
Yes, yes. You're lower on the ladder.  
 
Interviewer 2  00:23 
Right? Last to come, first to go.  
 
Vi Hilbert  00:27 
They could cut out a few deans and pay for 10 years of my work. 
 
Interviewer 2  00:35 
I know. 
 
Jill G. Smith  00:36 
Exactly. 
 
Interviewer 2  00:40 
One of the things [?Joe?] and I talked about was a collection of stories at the Burke Museum. 
And Joe called over there and found out that most 75% of them are in a language and about a 
quarter of them have been translated. And so we thought it would be sort of silly for us to go 
over and listen, unless we knew more or less what we were looking for. And you were the one 
who knew-- who knows what's there. And maybe you could direct us to listen to some stories 
that might be on the themes that we're looking for.  
 
Vi Hilbert  01:24 
Let me get my list of tapes. 
Page 2 of 17 
 
 
Jill G. Smith  01:51 
[Inaudible] get plugged into them. Is this funded basically through the University or through the 
state, too? 
 
Interviewer 2  02:04 
No, it's any age, totally. So--  
 
Jill G. Smith  02:06 
Oh any age. You don't come under the budget ax.  
 
Interviewer 2  02:09 
Oh, I know, suddenly my piddling little salary looks golden. Nobody can touch it. Except people 
try to-- [Laughter.] 
 
Vi Hilbert  02:27 
Oh, let's see. These are just some I just finished. This is-- 
 
Jill G. Smith  02:38 
These are in English. You've redone these [crosstalk]?  
 
Vi Hilbert  02:42 
Yes, yes. Here's a page before that. 
 
Jill G. Smith  02:49 
Fly Story. I've never heard the Fly Story. 
 
Vi Hilbert  02:51 
No, no, that's Duwamish. That one needs more work on it. I wanted to see if I could translate the 
Duwamish language. But there-- it has some bridges that need to be crossed yet. 
 
Jill G. Smith  03:09 
"Sockeye on Baker River." I just spent most my entire summer up on Mount Baker and up on 
Mount Shuksan climbing and hanging around up there. 
 
Vi Hilbert  03:21 
Yeah, that's a beautiful story. Now, I haven't polished that one up for my Haboo books yet. But 
that one is a wonderful story and it's so appropriate to my Skagit country; they're going to use 
that in some of their fishing rights materials.  
 
Interviewer 2  03:42 
Have you found that people are-are reincorporating the stories into their ritual life?  
 
Vi Hilbert  03:48 
Yes, uh-huh, or where they realize that they exist. Right now, see, our legend tells us by Aunt 
Susie's tale that the sockeye will always come back to Baker River. That legend didn't know that 
Page 3 of 17 
 
there was going to be a dam put in and it stopped around the sockeye up there. But they have 
since put a ladder up for them and the Sockeye are finding their way back to Baker. And when I 
was told that this summer, I was so pleased. I said, "Now Aunt Susie's story can be true again." 
 
Interviewer 2  04:28 
It's sometimes [inaudible] that they did that.  
 
Vi Hilbert  04:34 
This is the whole list of the Metcalf tapes. 
 
Jill G. Smith  04:42 
Such work. 
 
Interviewer 2  04:46 
The tape that our group is working on has as a theme-- well, two sort of themes; one is women at 
work, and then as an extension of that, women building communities. And that occurred to me as 
I was listening to them talk and plan this, that -- and I've also heard people talk this way -- when 
the white women as pioneers came in, when they're talking about building community, they're 
talking about building churches, building schools, being on PTAs, and women's groups, and 
hospitals, and things like that. And it seems to me as the-- as history progresses, as time goes on, 
that perhaps white women never understood the sense of community that Native American 
women had to begin with; that community is something that includes not just the human 
community, but the natural community, the animal world, the Spirit community; that community 
is a really much wider term. And I wondered if there are any stories about women building 
community, but in this sense that would be surprising to white women. Surprising in the sense 
that linking worlds, linking things, together... 
 
06:23 
Well, again, I come back to the Starchild story. 
 
Interviewer 2  06:27 
Starchild story.  
 
Vi Hilbert  06:28 
This is the one that does all of that. 
 
Interviewer 2  06:31 
That's what you said too, Jill. 
 
Jill G. Smith  06:33 
Yeah. 
 
Interviewer 2  06:34 
So we would look to that.  So we should-- are those in your Haboo books? 
 
Vi Hilbert  06:41 
Page 4 of 17 
 
Yeah, that's in the Haboo book. 
 
Interviewer 2  06:42 
"Haboo" book? 
 
Vi Hilbert  06:44 
The word "Haboo," I should have footnoted information about Haboo. Haboo is something that 
the storyteller expects the audience to come out with, so when they're listening, so that the 
storyteller knows that you're paying attention, that you're interested, that you're not asleep. You 
say, "Haboo. Haboo." 
 
Interviewer 2  07:03 
Oh. Haboo. That's funny the-- I know an Indian who is a Chippewa Cree, and when he listens to 
a story, he sometimes puts his head down like that. He doesn't look right at the storyteller. But 
he's listening, because every once in a while he goes, "[?How?]." Like that. 
 
Vi Hilbert  07:20 
Like Haboo. 
 
Jill G. Smith  07:27 
And "[?Yihauʔ?]" was-- 
 
Interviewer 2  07:27 
Haboo, Haboo. [?Yihauʔ?], go ahead.  
 
Jill G. Smith  07:30 
Go ahead, tell me a story. 
 
Vi Hilbert  07:34 
[?Yihauʔ?]. 
 
Interviewer 2  07:34 
[?Yihauʔ?]? 
 
Vi Hilbert  07:34 
[?Yihauʔ?]. 
 
Interviewer 2  07:35 
[?Yihauʔ?]. 
 
Vi Hilbert  07:37 
Yes. Yes, I've done all of my own typing in the last two volumes. I feel better about it; if I make 
a mistake, then it's my mistake. 
 
Jill G. Smith  07:49 
You have a typewriter with the lexicals? 
Page 5 of 17 
 
 
Interviewer 2  07:55 
Made your own typewriter, too?  
 
Vi Hilbert  07:58 
Yes. 
 
Interviewer 2  08:02 
There are so many places just in the story names-- 
 
Vi Hilbert  08:09 
Yes.  
 
Interviewer 2  08:10 
--that I know. 
 
08:13 
Yes, now, Dr. Hess has been thinking for many years about doing an article on Indian place 
names and the way that they're used here in the state. And-- 
 
Jill G. Smith  08:35 
Or misused. 
 
Vi Hilbert  08:36 
Yes, or misused. And some of my graduate students who were wanting to continue working with 
me wanted to know what they could do for a project.  I said, "Well, I don't know." But... Mark 
Stanley, do you remember Mark Stanley, or was he far after you? 
 
Jill G. Smith  09:01 
Think he may have been just before or just after. 
 
09:05 
He said, "What I would like is-- I would like to help with a project that had an end to it. No, not 
an ongoing project." So I said, "Well, this place name thing that Thom has been talking about 
might be something that you could help with." I said, "Thom would need somebody to dig out 
information from this end, the archives, and so forth." So he-- I asked Thom, you know, if he 
was going to be pursuing this place name project, and I had two students who would like to help 
with it. So-- [?at least two?]. So Mark Stanley and Pam Cahn. 
 
Jill G. Smith  09:53 
Oh, great. Yeah, most of them are familiar to me because I've been there.  
 
Vi Hilbert  09:58 
Yes. 
 
Jill G. Smith  09:58 
Page 6 of 17 
 
Most of the stories take place in my favorite places. All of a sudden, I've been going to all these 
places by myself and just put my pack on my back and hike up there and stay for days, and they 
feel very powerful to me. [Crosstalk] Mount Baker. 
 
Interviewer 2  10:13 
Wow, [?how've?] you been doing that? 
 
Vi Hilbert  10:13 
Oh, wonderful. 
 
Jill G. Smith  10:21 
I spent the whole summer up on Mount Baker, pretty much, just by myself.  
 
Vi Hilbert  10:26 
My mom-- you know he-- that's the only male mountain, don't you? 
 
Jill G. Smith  10:31 
Oh, really? Shuksan, was just right next to it; it's not-- 
 
Vi Hilbert  10:35 
Not male. 
 
Jill G. Smith  10:36 
Not male? 
 
Vi Hilbert  10:37 
No, the story comes down to [inaudible]. Mount Baker is a man. The others are women. 
 
Jill G. Smith  10:45 
Should be, he grumbles a lot. [Laughter.] 
 
Vi Hilbert  10:49 
Bad temper.  
 
Jill G. Smith  10:51 
Yeah. I was up on the Upper Baker River, closer to the Shuksan part of it, and I was camping up 
there all by myself. And I was gonna spend about five or six days, and it was lovely and sunny, 
and I'd gone out past these huge, beautiful beaver ponds. And about nine o'clock that evening, 
I'm just doing my chili, and I get a hail storm with thunder and lightning and rain just in buckets. 
 
Interviewer 2  11:18 
Wow. 
 
Jill G. Smith  11:21 
But I have a good tent. 
 
Page 7 of 17 
 
Vi Hilbert  11:23 
Did you fast while you were up there, Jill? 
 
Jill G. Smith  11:25 
Yeah. Not on that trip, when I went up Shuksan. That was the first mountain I climbed this 
summer and I fasted for four days when I was up on Shuksan. 
 
11:36 
So you should have some strong [?squall?], [?I took?], to help you in your work. 
 
Jill G. Smith  11:42 
I was very amazed; on the third day, I was sitting in a glacier and just four feet away from me, a 
mother ptarmigan and about six of her little chicks said, "Peep peep peep peep." And they 
stopped and they looked at me, just, "Peep peep peep peep." [Laughter.] This little brood in 
between the rocks. 
 
Interviewer 2  11:59 
Took a good look?  
 
Jill G. Smith  12:00 
Yeah, she looked at me. She couldn't figure out what I was doing, I think. 
 
12:05 
Now, is that enough information for you? Because when I archived my first material, I wrote 
little explanations of what the material was. 
 
Jill G. Smith  12:19 
This should be the starting point, [inaudible] in English, and then I had the [?Yihauʔ?], but I 
want to get the Haboo book from you for sure before I go. And what-what are the logistics or the 
formalities, say, if we used one of the stories or part of the stories along with the filmstrip? Do 
we give you cr--? 
 
12:47 
Yeah, give me credit and the original storyteller credit. 
 
Jill G. Smith  12:53 
Okay. That will be easy.  
 
Vi Hilbert  12:54 
That's all.  
 
Jill G. Smith  12:56 
Yeah, some places, you know, get involved with Library of Congress numbers and [inaudible]. 
 
13:03 
No, no, I published that. The information, of course, belongs to the original storyteller.  
Page 8 of 17 
 
 
Jill G. Smith  13:11 
Oh. That's the way it should be. That's good.  
 
Vi Hilbert  13:17 
The stories Aunt Susie told, as far as I'm concerned, belong to her and anything-- anytime I am 
talking about them, "This is Aunt Susie's story." Harriette Shelton Dover gets credit for-- 
 
Jill G. Smith  13:29 
Good. 
 
Vi Hilbert  13:31 
--all the material I have of her family. 
 
Interviewer 2  13:35 
If there was a story or a part of a story that we wanted to use for the tape, I would-- would it be 
okay if I came back and checked that particular one with you and showed you how we were 
going to use it and everything? 
 
Vi Hilbert  13:49 
Mm-hmm. Yes. I would appreciate that.  
 
Interviewer 2  13:51 
Okay. 
 
13:54 
I'm sure with Jill's guidance, you wouldn't be misrepresenting anyway. 
 
Interviewer 2  13:59 
Well, I have my hesitations. On the one hand, I think it's terribly important have some stories. 
 
Vi Hilbert  14:07 
Mm-hmm. Oh, yes. 
 
Interviewer 2  14:07 
And that's the way the heritage exists. 
 
14:09 
Right. And how will the public know that these beautiful things are there if we keep them under 
lock and key? I mean, this has always been my philosophy. I teach on campus because I think it's 
important for people to have some knowledge about the primal people. 
 
Jill G. Smith  14:30 
I even took the [?Yihauʔ?] book and let my brother, who's 12, read it. He was quite happy. He 
was-- he started saying, "Well, how can I learn these type of things?" I said, "Well, you learn 
'em, but you've got to give credit though [laughs] [inaudible]."  
Page 9 of 17 
 
 
14:52 
I better put the-- that thing in here.  
 
Interviewer 2  14:55 
Did you [crosstalk]? 
 
14:57 
Yes, well [inaudible]-- I wanted to hear the Barnacle Song. 
 
15:02 
Oh, yes, [?Ray Paul?]. He's a blind man from [?Swinomish?]. One of my relatives. 
 
Jill G. Smith  15:13 
[Inaudible] perhaps [inaudible] wondered if we were introduced to him when we were up at 
Tulalip. 
 
Vi Hilbert  15:19 
No, no, he's at [?Swinomish?]. 
 
Jill G. Smith  15:20 
[?Swinomish?] [inaudible]. 
 
Vi Hilbert  15:22 
La Connor. 
 
Interviewer 2  15:24 
Oh. [?Vinish?]. [?Vinish?]? 
 
15:35 
Mm-hmm. [?Vi hi?]. When Leon Metcalf was taping this material, he was using his own funds. 
He not helped anywhere, so all this came out of his own pocket. So he had limited [inaudible] 
money for tape, so he would use up the whole tape. He didn't just put one piece of information 
on tape and then let half of the tape go; every bit of the tape was used [laughs]. 
 
Interviewer 2  16:02 
So he put some finished stories [?in there?]? 
 
16:05 
So sometimes, I have done one story that I can't-- he said to the storyteller, let's turn the tape 
over. Well, the story never got finished. So sometime, somewhere the end of the story will 
emerge. It wasn't vital to the storyline anyway, but I'll find it. 
 
Interviewer 2  16:41 
So this is a list of all his-- 
 
Page 10 of 17 
 
Vi Hilbert  16:45 
[Crosstalk.] 
 
Interviewer 2  16:45 
[?That was the whole?]--  
 
Vi Hilbert  16:45 
Everything that he turned into the Burke Museum. 
 
Interviewer 2  16:48 
The Burke must have a copy. 
 
Vi Hilbert  16:51 
They can't find it. [Inaudible] their master list.  
 
Interviewer 2  16:55 
No wonder they wouldn't [inaudible]. [Laughter.] 
 
Vi Hilbert  16:57 
[Crosstalk.] 
 
Interviewer 2  17:01 
He was reading it; he was going by memory as to just the peoples that he'd had. Different 
backgrounds, different stories from-- and he couldn't say, "Well, I don't know which specific 
stories, you just have to come listen yourself." I'm going, "Oh, my."  
 
Vi Hilbert  17:17 
Yes. [Inaudible] it was misplaced. And they haven't asked me for-- my mind's pretty-- I would 
have to retype this for them, I guess. And I should do that sometime. 
 
Jill G. Smith  17:26 
Or Xerox and let them. But these numbers that I copied down for the Starchild, especially, that'll-
- they'll know what to do?  
 
Vi Hilbert  17:37 
Oh, yes. Yes, all of their tapes are organized. 
 
Jill G. Smith  17:46 
[Inaudible] particularly beautiful. 
 
Vi Hilbert  17:50 
Yes, oh, yes. 
 
17:55 
You know, I have my-- well, you know, how the students had to analyze the four different 
versions. And they did such a beautiful job of that, all of them. Because they could appreciate the 
Page 11 of 17 
 
style of each individual storyteller. And they would analyze the-- each story and then compare 
the different styles. 
 
Interviewer 2  18:17 
Is there-- are stories given to a storyteller passed down from a storyteller to a storyteller? On 
certain occasions, and does each person have their [inaudible]? 
 
Vi Hilbert  18:29 
No, it's not firmly given. I think that the stories are just told over and over within a family till 
they memorized. And-- because all of us have different degrees of interests, maybe one story 
wouldn't appeal to [?you, say?], "Yeah, I want to remember that one." But like the Starchild 
story, I think that if I were to memorize something as long as that epic, why, that would be a 
life's work. I wonder how often my Aunt Susie heard that. But she had such a fantastic mind, that 
maybe she only heard it a few times, and the main points of the story were so interesting to her, 
that she she kept it in her mind. 
 
Interviewer 2  19:17 
So you sort of self select your-- 
 
Vi Hilbert  19:19 
Yes. Yes. Uh-huh.  
 
Interviewer 2  19:20 
--as a storyteller; it's just something you happen to do? 
 
Vi Hilbert  19:22 
Interesting to me to remember. 
 
Interviewer 2  19:24 
And there are no particular clubs or lodges?  
 
Vi Hilbert  19:28 
No, oh, no. No, no. No, these-- 
 
Interviewer 2  19:30 
Just within the family.  
 
Vi Hilbert  19:31 
Mm-hmm. And I understand that the stories were told generally in the wintertime, because 
naturally, in the summertime, you're too busy gathering food and storing it away to sit in the 
longhouse and listen to stories. 
 
Jill G. Smith  19:51 
Maybe that's why my writing goes so well in the winter. 
 
Interviewer 2  19:54 
Page 12 of 17 
 
You're up on Mount Baker in the summer [laughs]. 
 
19:59 
[Inaudible] inspiration from your trips up into the mountains. [Inaudible] that's the way our 
people did, [?Jill?]. They found a kind of inspiration there that giving-- gave them strength to 
live everyplace else.  
 
Jill G. Smith  20:18 
Boy, isn't that a-- that's a hard [inaudible].  
 
Vi Hilbert  20:21 
I hope it doesn't do this next Saturday, I have a big [?sound?]-- big birthday party planned for my 
daughter; I have 30 people coming. 
 
Interviewer 2  20:29 
Here? To your house? 
 
Jill G. Smith  20:31 
You have the yard for it. It's a beautiful yard. 
 
Vi Hilbert  20:36 
Yes, we have those quite often. 
 
Jill G. Smith  20:41 
Did we--  
 
Interviewer 2  20:42 
Yep. 
 
Jill G. Smith  20:43 
And did you want to talk to Vi about Ron and his-- 
 
Interviewer 2  20:49 
Yeah, I don't know.  
 
Jill G. Smith  20:50 
I don't know, what could we-- 
 
Vi Hilbert  20:51 
Oh. 
 
Interviewer 2  20:51 
What-- we have some advi-- I just want to ask you for your advice, I guess. I have a friend who 
teaches at Walla Walla. And she is putting on a storytelling symposium in February, and inviting 
people from around the country, including a man named Ron Evans, from Chippewa Cree, in 
Canada. And I've heard him tell stories. He's a wonderful storyteller. In their tribe, they have a 
Page 13 of 17 
 
person who's designated.  Well, they select themselves, too, but it's more formalized, I think. 
And they have to join a certain lodge or club kind of thing, and get trained. And he was trained 
for years as a storyteller and historian. And he's called Keeper of the Talking Sticks. And he's 
going to be in Walla Walla for her symposium on storytelling. And she wanted to know if we 
would like to invite him at the University of Washington to come. And he's also bringing the 
elders of his tribe. 
 
Vi Hilbert  21:58 
Oh, my goodness. 
 
Interviewer 2  21:59 
And it seems to me that-- 
 
Vi Hilbert  22:02 
Oh, how marvelous. 
 
Interviewer 2  22:03 
[Laughs] I feel the same way. But I don't know how to arrange it. And maybe you have some 
advice on-- at least-- I felt like, at least we should-- I should see if I can find the money to pay 
for the travel or for a little bit of an honorarium. And I don't know what setting to have this 
happen, and who should [?sponsor?]-- 
 
22:31 
I wish I could speak for Indian Studies, but they're telling me already that I have no money.  
 
Interviewer 2  22:35 
I know [laughs].  
 
Vi Hilbert  22:37 
So whether my daughter-- whether my daughter could give us some help, because I think for all 
of the Indian students that she would feel this is important. So let's ask my daughter. 
 
Jill G. Smith  22:53 
I think it would be an important thing if we could get them to even videotape something.  
 
Vi Hilbert  23:00 
Oh, yes. 
 
Jill G. Smith  23:01 
'Cause, like, the videotapes of Isadore are just-- but he doesn't--?  
 
Interviewer 2  23:05 
I'm not sure. He's a little touchy about things. [Crosstalk]. He's not like, you see-- I guess he has 
that feeling that he's a storyteller and he's going to keep it alive orally. And he says people can 
take, but not write down. I'm not sure about video. 
 
Page 14 of 17 
 
23:20 
Oh, oh, [?no?]. And that-- anyway, everything is copyrighted, and he has everything copyrighted 
and [inaudible]. 
 
Interviewer 2  23:26 
I wouldn't speak for him, I'm just not sure about that. 
 
Jill G. Smith  23:29 
Might be something to ask him, because he probably would never return to us again. And that 
would be one way of keeping what has happened, because since he doesn't write them down for 
us. 
 
Interviewer 2  23:41 
Maybe it'd be alright; video's not writing it down. Anyway, but we can certainly ask him.  
 
Jill G. Smith  23:46 
It's important-- it's also-- the thing I like about videos, it's important to see the storyteller sort of 
telling it. 
 
Vi Hilbert  23:52 
Oh, yes. I wish I had all of mine on video. 
 
Jill G. Smith  23:53 
I know, yeah, it's almost better than than a tape. They do so much with their face and hands.  
 
Interviewer 2  24:00 
Yeah. For me, listening to Ron is like a big event. I mean, I have to prepare myself, and I can't 
just walk off the street and sit down and say [inaudible] a story. 
 
24:19 
Well, Harriette Shelton Dover, you know, is a storyteller. All her life she was trained by her 
father to be a storyteller. 
 
Jill G. Smith  24:32 
There's a certain power [inaudible]. 
 
Interviewer 2  24:34 
Yeah, he certainly-- 
 
24:34 
I had a wonderful gift here Saturday evening after I got home from the wedding. A friend from 
Washington State had called earlier and asked if he could come over; he had a tape to give me. 
You know, the salmon ceremony that was done at Tulalip? And Harriette is, you know, narrating 
that and her son makes a nice speech and Morris Dan makes a nice speech. It's an hour long tape 
that my students will get to see. If you're on campus when-- and I'm-- 
 
Page 15 of 17 
 
Jill G. Smith  25:19 
I'd love to see it. 
 
Vi Hilbert  25:20 
[Inaudible]. 
 
Jill G. Smith  25:22 
I have-- I will be on campus, for sure. 
 
Interviewer 2  25:25 
So, will you be teaching winter and spring, but just not next year?  
 
Vi Hilbert  25:30 
Next year I'll be fall, winter and spring. The language will go three quarters. And then next year 
I'm not on. It says in writing. But I have an idea, if the program gets reshuffled under another 
head, my daughter will probably see to it that it's there. 
 
Interviewer 2  25:55 
Will they be continuing the grammar courses at all? 
 
26:02 
Well, the way Indian Studies-- their rationale was it should be offered every other year. My 
daughter, so exasperated, said, "Well, then English should be offered every other year." Was that 
stupid kind of rationale. They feel if it's offered every other year, then I would have the kind of 
enrollment that I have, the 46. 
 
Interviewer 2  26:28 
46 is an awful good number. I think they should be real impressed with it. 
 
26:35 
But I think that this 46 number comes from the students who have been in my literature classes 
and have been fascinated with the storytellers. 
 
Jill G. Smith  26:46 
Can you take that literature course more than once? 
 
26:49 
I imagine you would have to take it under that other blanket number, independent study number. 
If you haven't used up your independent studies. 
 
Jill G. Smith  26:58 
Maybe I'll have to-- because you've definitely expanded. 
 
Interviewer 2  27:02 
Page 16 of 17 
 
Well, you know, if the University of Washington is going to behave this way, I think community 
colleges, maybe you'll be more receptive, I don't know. Maybe let the University of Washington 
cut all the interesting things out, they'll go someplace better. [Laughter.] 
 
Vi Hilbert  27:29 
Well, you know, my philosophy is that the Lushootseed has demanded to be kept alive, and not 
through my doing. I've been pushed into the position of being keeper of the information and the 
teacher of it; I've never asked to do it. Was not my seeking it out that made it happen; it came to 
me. Well, if it's supposed to be continued, Vi, there'll be doors opening that will say, "Come on, 
here to do it here." So that's my philosophy.  
 
Jill G. Smith  28:10 
Probably always-- 
 
Interviewer 2  28:11 
You can't beat it. 
 
Jill G. Smith  28:12 
--a few students that pursue it. 
 
28:13 
And I have had many voices raised in its defense. I think that made some effect on the University 
of Washington. And [inaudible], you know, had the petition signed by a body of scholars at the 
Salish Conference. And that was sent to the powers that be. 
 
Interviewer 2  28:37 
[?I haven't seen her in a?] long time, but bravo. 
 
28:44 
She's expecting another baby in November. And she's working on that Fulbright Scholarship. 
She's fulfilling her responsibilities to it this year. For eight months, she'll be in Canada. She's 
coming to my party on Saturday. Sort of a farewell to Seattle.  
 
Jill G. Smith  29:12 
Good luck.  
 
Vi Hilbert  29:15 
She's such a fine human being. She'll do good work, I'm sure. 
 
Interviewer 2  29:24 
We had a very amazing language class. They were all very fine people. I see a few of them here 
and there once in a while, once in a great while. The ones that stick it out to the end .[Laughter] 
can be difficult. Some of us wanted to go a second quarter but I just couldn't get my schedule to 
do it. I may brush up on my tapes and enroll a second quarter this year. 
 
29:55 
Page 17 of 17 
 
Those students who have come through a second time feel so relieved, because they don't have 
to-- it's not such a struggle the second time through, and they understand more. 
 
Interviewer 2  30:10 
I think when you're learning a language, you struggle and struggle for oh, three, four, five 
months and all of a sudden... They come in a lurch, sort of-- it's not so strange anymore. It's still 
hard, but-- 
 
Jill G. Smith  30:24 
That's hard to believe. 
 
Vi Hilbert  30:24 
Yes, it's a very difficult language to learn. Said to Thom, and he was [inaudible] the fact that, 
"How are you going to handle 46 students?" I said, "I'll just have to get my whip out, Thom." 
[Laughter.] With my wet noodle [inaudible]. [Laughter.] Did you see that article?  
 
Jill G. Smith  30:47 
No, I didn't get a chance to pick that up. Run around. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 